Re: [Legal -again-] Contributions

From: Daniel Koepke (dkoepke@CALIFORNIA.COM)
Date: 08/17/97

On Sun, 17 Aug 1997, Andrew Helm wrote:

-+And what if I agreed with the license? You seem to have stopped mid
-+sentence there, Daniel.

I wouldn't doubt the sloppy manner in which the message was written.  I had
to leave at the very time (you never want to miss an appointment with the
DMV, because on the off-chance that they don't make you wait an hour for
your appointment...)

-+Can you not read or did you just decide to ignore the last half of
-+that sentence? What do you think "or be compensated in any way" means?

Uhm, excuse me, "or be compensated in any way" means making monetary gain.
What do you think "compensated" means?

-+Unfortunately, I'm begining to see the futility of trying to get a point
-+across to you. What do you think the words "You must not solicit or
-+accept money or other donations in exchange for running CircleMUD." means?

I'm not saying it doesn't prohibit donations, what I am saying is that it
prohibits any type of monetary gain (which *includes* donations).  Do you
want it German, French, Spanish, hieroglyphs?!  The main purpose of that
is to prohibit someone from *making money off of CircleMUD*.

If someone sends you money because they like to play your game (eg., donated),
the acceptance of that money would be MONETARY GAIN off of CircleMUD.

-+What do you think the words "You must not accept money or other donations
-+from your players for purposes such as hardware upgrades for running
-+CircleMUD" means? It is specifically against donations among other things.
-+I wish you would read the license.

I wish you understood half the things you're told.  (BTW, I have read the
license, I've read it more than once, I've read it recently, I've got a
printed copy of it, I have read your copies of the license; and the facts
don't change).

-+A) You've invented some fanciful term called "Monetary Gain."

I haven't invented that term, it's a very basic term.  "Monetary" meaning
"of or pertaining to money", and "gain" (which I'm sure you understand)..
Full (rough) translation: "gain of money".

-+B) You proceeded to show that all restrictions against donations fall under
-+   restrictions against "Monetary Gain."
-+C) Then, you reason that since the license *only* prevents "Monetary Gain,"
-+   donations are okay.

I would normally call you a, "fucking idiot," right here; but perhaps I have
been unclear and a bit patronizing, so I'll explain.  You cannot make money
off of CircleMUD (monetary gain).  If someone thinks your MUD is real cool
and sends you money/whatever, your acceptance of this "gift" hence means
that you have made money/whatever because of CircleMUD.  In other words, it
is not forbidding someone from making a donation, it's forbidding you from
ACCEPTING donations or asking for donations.

What I said in my last paragraph was simply this.  The license *DOES NOT*
say, "You cannot accept donations from anyone for any reason as long as you
run CircleMUD," and it does not say, "No-one can make a donation to you."
It is saying that you cannot *ACCEPT* donations/compensensation sent to you
because of your CircleMUD.  So, no, it's not robbing some of their free
will, it's telling you that you can't *accept* those donations.

BTW, I wouldn't doubt that you were correct on the fact that someone cannot
sign a contract that takes away their basic rights.  I was using the example
you provided without forethought to basic rights.  (In other words, the
intention counted for more than the wording).

So now, what I'm saying, and to go back to the "slavery" analogy.  What the
license is saying is not that you can't choose to be my slave for 5 years,
but that I cannot accept you as my slave for 5 years, if (one of) the reason(s)
for you offering to be my slave is because of my CircleMUD.  I can't get that
quite phrased right (the "because of" doesn't quite capture the thought).

But then, perhaps I'm wrong, perhaps the license can't say you can't accept
money for CircleMUD.  So, there goes a *whole* ton of software licenses, and
I think I'll be starting up a business selling shareware to unsuspecting

Daniel Koepke -:- -:-  [Shadowlord/Nether]

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