Re: [THREAD] Fairness in Circle WAS: Copyrights, ...

From: James Turner (turnerjh@XTN.NET)
Date: 06/25/98

Del Minturn <caminturn@EARTHLINK.NET> writes:

> I will say this much, It is fair! If it was not, there would be no
> reason to post it and provide it on any site. Yet a lot of snippets
> are available on MANY sites. Many players like certain features, it
> is benificial for everyone to post the snippets that the players
> like so the coder's/administrators or whomever can install
> them. Maybe with the attitudes lately we should all install linux
> and develop our own muds, take circlemud code out completely. Hell,
> your using freeware (or whateverware) and adding more freeware to
> it. Is it is fair? Yes.
> :)

No mud can be built out of snippets and stock code; it takes much
more than that, as I think most of us realize.  But... it's simply not
fair to steal code, rip it off, or pass it on to your users as your
own -- and we all know that happens.  If someone makes code available
to the public, they will inevitably end up with the short end of the
stick.  I'm not sure of the attitudes you're railing against; I
certainly have NEVER complained about circlemud or its community... in
fact, when I have time, I go out of my way to help when and where I
can, as do many others.

But it simply isn't a fair deal in and of itself.  This is pretty much
fact and I don't think there is much disputing it -- the irreputable
admins are the ones who make it that way.  But that doesn't deter
anyone most of the time... snippets still get made public.  There is a
flaw in snippets, though; they make it too easy in many respects.  Too
easy?  How can it be too easy?  Anytime you lower the minimum required
knowledge to do anything you'll end up with people who are in over
their heads forcing the community to pay for it.

Evidence: AOL/Prodigy did it to the internet.  They put ten million
people on the net and helped make it the success it has been.  It's a
trade off; however, browse any usenet newsgroup and you'll see a huge
amount of clueless newbies with aol accounts (not to say all AOLers
are bad; just a general trend among the majority).  The same happens
with Circlemud.  People patch snippets into stock and post when there
are problems -- very, VERY simple problems.

But we need newbies to survive.  But when someone isn't willing to put
the work in that they ask of you, you must wonder.  A lot of people
expect those in the know to simply code something for them, or fix all
their problems.  That is a very wrong attitude.

If you don't know basic C syntax, don't understand declarations,
prototypes, basic functions, and structures, then you shouldn't be
admining a Circlemud.  You need to find someone who does to handle the
code end of it.  There are exceptions, but I personally am a whole lot
more willing to help someone if it is clear they've put an effort into
first helping themselves.  Another thing to watch for is if they
follow up on your response and ask intelligent questions that are
aimed not at fixing their immediate problem but at learning what their
current problem is caused by and fixing it from there.

> How about going back to DOS 5 or 6 and writing your own version of
> Windows 95/98?

Nah I'd rather write a new unix-like OS ;)

> The weakness of the CircleMUD community, IMO is the lack of support for
> the newbie!

Responded to this above.  Most are willing to help newbies; it's the
ones who refuse to help themselves that irritate most of us.

> One last note:
> For all of you who think it is not fair, I suggest removing circleMUD
> and write your own. I will bet there is only ONE out there that would be
> able to do it. A few others would make an attempt at it and give up. The
> rest would not even attempt.

But it isn't fair.  People do it out of a sense of community, out of a
sense to repay the good they've received, out of a desire to
enlighten others... and, yes, out of a desire for fame/renown for
having others use their code.  I'd suggest reading The Cathedral and the
Bazaar by Eric Raymond (dont' have te URL handy).  It goes very much
into the open source software movement, why people code for it, why it
works, etc.  Definitely worth a read.


James Turner                   UIN: 1102038

     | Ensure that you have read the CircleMUD Mailing List FAQ:  |
     | |

This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : 12/15/00 PST