Re: Thought on a level-less and class-less system

From: Artovil (
Date: 01/18/02

At 09:02 2002-01-18 -0800, you wrote:
>I've been toying with ideas, looking at different possibilities and throwing
>out the non-workable ones and keeping others.  I'm trying to come a way to
>adequately have an "open-ended" system where not everyone look alike and yet
>balance the system.  Take for example, let's say I code in GURPS system and
>allow profession templates.  I had in mind where you take the knight
>profession but you still can learn thief skills, just at a higher cost.  You
>could also learn magic, provided you customized and took magery advantage.
>Now, would that still be a class system as defined by the current systems?
>Or could that be considered class-less?  Words can be vague and misleading.
>I guess one has to examine what do people mean when they say class-less or
>As for being open-ended, I had in mind where you could increase your stats
>but it gets harder and harder to increase your stat or skill to the next
>point.  I'm not sure if this is necessarily a good or bad idea.  I am on a
>mud that has the remort system and stats that can go as high as 500.
>(really expensive but doable and time-consuming).  I guess it's a system
>just like any other.  One can only come up with a system and hope that the
>game is fun enough that people want to play. :)
>As for coding in the GURPS system, I'd imagine that I wouldn't be able to
>put the mud up since it's a copyrighted system.  I'm pretty sure that I'd
>have to request permission from Steve Jackson Games to do so.  I can't
>imagine they'd deny it since I wouldn't make any money off it.  :)  Assuming
>that I get it off the ground, of course. :p
>Coding the game is the easy part.  What's hard is coming up with a good
>system that stands out and is fun and playable.  As for my doing the above?
>I'm not ready for that since I still need to finish studying and annotating
>circlemud stock code.  I'm just tossing out thoughts and ideas and seeing if
>anyone else would get ideas from my ideas.  Sometimes all it takes is a
>spark and a whole flame of ideas burst forth.
>Enough of my ramblings :)
>Gerald Florence (Septe)


<towhomitmayconcern>Some of you may doubt that I can post civilized, polite
posts, but here's the proof.</towhomitmayconcern>

I did some research on game mechanics for Arcane Realms, and most of the
systems are totally incompatible with the CircleMUD license due to the fact
that they either state that the entire CircleMUD code be made available to
them, or any other snag you might come up with.

We looked both at GURPS, Fuzion, d20 and others, and they are all that
way.  This includes anything from Steven Jackson Games, Wizards of the
Coast, White Wolf, and others.

So, what did I find?  I found several systems that are totally free of use
as long as you do not market them commercially, and a few of them were
totally compatible with the CM license.  The one that I looked at and used
as a foundation for my MUD is called Circe.

We took the "skill tree" road where we use skill requirements in order to
determine what a player can learn, and we are also going to use some sort
of skill cap system as soon as I find some sort of middle path between all
the copyrighted skills are taught by mob tutors, books (for academic
skills), or players with the skill "teaching".

Here is a page with free rpg links:

ObCircle: If anyone is interested in how we at Arcane Realms handled
level-less/class-less user rights and master command list and so forth and
so on, let us know, and perhaps Cheron can whip together some snippets.

Torgny Bjers (Artovil)

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